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Countdown to The Ashes: Key Players and Predictions with Ben Brettell
The forthcoming Ashes series between England and Australia is poised to be a highly significant event in the cricketing calendar. As England embarks on their tour of Australia, the discourse surrounding team preparations, player form, and historical performance becomes increasingly pertinent. Notably, England has not secured an Ashes victory on Australian soil since 2011, a statistic that weighs heavily on the minds of players and fans alike. Concurrently, Australia grapples with injury concerns, including the absence of their captain Pat Cummins for the initial Test, which may alter the dynamics of the series. Our discussions delve into the contrasting trajectories of both teams as they approach this storied rivalry, analyzing the implications of recent performances and the potential impact of strategic decisions made by both camps.
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Transcript
All right.
Speaker A:Hello and welcome to the last Wicked.
Speaker A:I'm your host Benny.
Speaker A:Thank you for joining us.
Speaker A:And today we have my co host Mike joining us.
Speaker A:Hey, Mike.
Speaker B:Hey Benny.
Speaker A:And we also have our returning guest who I think we can just make him the third host of this podcast very soon, given the frequency with which he's appearing.
Speaker A:But Ben, Brett, welcome back.
Speaker C:Thanks, Benny.
Speaker C:Great to be here.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well, good to have you here.
Speaker A:And obviously this episode we're going to be talking about the Ashes, you know, always an event whenever it's on the calendar and with England touring Australia and all of the narratives, all of the, the contests and the players lining up, it should be, it should be a fun series and there's, there's plenty to talk about.
Speaker A:But this build up to the Ashes, we have England playing limited over international to New Zealand and not doing a great job at it, while Australia is playing India, the same, you know, playing T20s and ODI internationals.
Speaker A:We don't really seem to have the concept of tour games anymore.
Speaker A:So how are you guys feeling about, you know, the buildup for both teams towards Ashes?
Speaker C:I think the lack of tour games is just the way of modern cricket now.
Speaker C:There's so much cricket in the schedule and so many of the players play, play more than one format.
Speaker C:The, the days of an Ashes tour lasting kind of three months with games against the States and Prime Minister's elevens and all sorts of.
Speaker C:I remember those other teams, I remember them too.
Speaker C:And, and it, you know, I think they're just over just because of the amount of cricket in the calendar.
Speaker C:And you know, England are adamant that the lack of warm ups.
Speaker C:I think they've got one game against the Lions.
Speaker C:They're adamant that won't hurt them.
Speaker C:And to be fair, they do have a record, a decent record in the first game of an away series.
Speaker C:But yeah, the, The New Zealand ODIs have been obviously hugely disappointing from an England point of view.
Speaker C:Not, not surprising, but disappointing.
Speaker C:New Zealand have got an amazing home record saw this morning.
Speaker C: heir home games in ODIs since: Speaker C:Top of the table for that.
Speaker C:And England have been a poor ODI team for ages now.
Speaker C:My son Freddie actually said to me this morning that England's Test team would be better at ODIs than their ODI team.
Speaker C:And I think that's probably true.
Speaker C:They just haven't got the hang of the tempo and the need to play sensibly early on, especially now there's a new ball from each end.
Speaker C:I think they just haven't really got the hang of it.
Speaker C:Like, obviously I would have preferred us to win, but I'm trying desperately not to read too much into it because it's just such a different format.
Speaker C:I'm taking the positives out, you know.
Speaker C:Brooks 100 was outstanding.
Speaker C:Archer and cast looked like they were in good rhythm, but yeah, that's about it.
Speaker C:And I think, not to mention Jacob Bethel will be kicking himself because they've kind of paved the way for him to make his way into the test team by taking the vice captaincy off Pope.
Speaker C:So the door was open and then these three close to zero scores in New Zealand.
Speaker C:Just kind of, he's hardly forcing his way through that open door.
Speaker C:So it'd be really interesting to see whether Pope's at 3 or Bethel when it comes to Perth.
Speaker B:Yeah, I will say about the tour games, I feel like India built their success overseas on that.
Speaker B:And when I say that is obviously this is.
Speaker B:Maybe it's a little bit pre Covid or just after Covid where India would always have an A team touring just before the main tour and that way if there were injuries, we had somebody come in, you know.
Speaker B:Mohammed Siraj of course, is known, is a known product of that a system where he played a lot of games and picked up a lot of wickets before getting picked for the senior team.
Speaker B:And there's, he's not, he's not the only one, there's many others.
Speaker B:So I, I definitely thought the tour games added something.
Speaker B:But I mean, I will say that, you know, sometimes these countries, the host countries do have really ordinary oppositions or have pitches which are not great quality.
Speaker B:So then those store games don't really matter as much.
Speaker B:So I, I do see why England would be, you know, wouldn't be, you know, would have cynicism towards these store games.
Speaker B:But, but yeah, it is a little bit weird because I, I expected them to at least play maybe some three day games, something like that.
Speaker B:But yeah, looks like they're directly going into it.
Speaker C:England used to lose most of the tour games and then go into the first test absolutely mentally shot because they just lost to B team.
Speaker A:That's why they don't want to play anymore.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think the other interesting part of the build up is just like the injuries, there's been plenty of injuries, I know like Archer was, is now looking, looking like he's, you know, really fit.
Speaker B:But, but on Australia side there's, there's quite a few injuries of course out of the first Test.
Speaker B:But also Cameron Green is still not 100.
Speaker B:So there's quite a few injuries that are happening.
Speaker B:So again, like, I feel like in the, in the past you would have the Ashes and people would be.
Speaker B:The teams would be really preparing their key players to not play too much cricket.
Speaker B:But that's obviously not.
Speaker B:Not the thing anymore.
Speaker B:There's just too much cricket from franchise cricket to, to ODIs to T20s, that you can only restrict their game time as so much.
Speaker A:I think the advent of T20s and franchise cricket pretty much everywhere now, while it probably affects fitness or leads to injury concerns for players ahead of major series like these, on the other hand, they still offer familiarity of conditions.
Speaker A:So even without tour games, since a lot of these players, you know, English players come to Australia to play the BBL and some of the Aussies go and play the blast like in England.
Speaker A:So there's always familiarity that I feel the tour games are not as critical for kind of getting a feel of the conditions prior to like, you know, major series.
Speaker A:But with.
Speaker A: n an Ashes in Australia since: Speaker A:And given the importance of Ashes, like even, you know, I, I especially feel this about England, Ben, and you can feel free to defend if you don't agree with me, but it feels like whenever any team plays England, it's always put in the context of the Ashes, right?
Speaker A:Like, even if it's even India or New Zealand, let's say the touring England, or if a player is selected, you know, it's always framed like, oh, this will be good.
Speaker A:It's a good opportunity to test this player ahead of the Ashes.
Speaker A:So given the importance given to Ashes in England, what do you make of that record where they haven't won in Ashes in, in Australia for the longest time?
Speaker A:And how do you feel about, you know, all the preparation and everything that has led up to the current one?
Speaker C:I think it, I think it's a very difficult place to go and win test matches.
Speaker C: y, yeah, we haven't won since: Speaker C:And I think the last time was so long ago that I was.
Speaker C:I think I was five.
Speaker C:The last time we won a five or six and night was 80, 86, 87.
Speaker C:I think it's.
Speaker C:I think it's true that England have been planning for this series ever since Stoke and McCullum took over.
Speaker C:And yeah, they've kind of wanted to take a.
Speaker C:Particularly the fast bowlers.
Speaker C:I think they've won.
Speaker C:They've been obsessed with taking a kind of this battery of quick men on tour and you know, they, that's, that's come together to a certain extent.
Speaker C:I think Bashir's selection is, is one that was kind of overseas Ashes based.
Speaker C:I think that that high release point talking about is based, you know, the reason that they like that is because they think it will be useful in Australia.
Speaker C:I think to some extent Crawley's continuing selection is because they think he'll go well in Australia on kind of faster, bouncier wickets with faster bowling.
Speaker C:So I think, I think they have been preparing for it ever, ever since, you know, basball started.
Speaker C:Whether, whether that will come off or not or whether it will just be yet another embarrassing failure, who knows?
Speaker C:But I do think, I do think that the plan has come together in terms of the group of players they're taking with them.
Speaker C:And yeah, you know, the plan probably wasn't lose three ODIs in New Zealand.
Speaker C:But you know, I think there's, there's more optimism over how the prep's gone than, than for many years before.
Speaker C:You know, it's normally the case that England are in total disarray.
Speaker C:They don't know what their best 11 is.
Speaker C:They don't know, you know, they're picking people out of county cricket with 30 averages because there's, there's no one good in the test team.
Speaker C:They're racked with injuries and, and this time does seem to be more settled and I think there's a, there's more optimism there.
Speaker A:You know, who they could turn to for advice.
Speaker A:There's a team that's won two series in Australia since England.
Speaker A:Last one in Ashes in Australia.
Speaker A:Do you, do you know who I'm talking about, Ben?
Speaker C:I don't.
Speaker A:Well, India have won two series down twice.
Speaker A:Have they since the last time England won.
Speaker A:In fact, I think that was their fourth first series win as well.
Speaker A:When they did win in the last few years, of course, we're just choosing to forget the most recent one.
Speaker C: One of them was in: Speaker B: Yeah,: Speaker B: So they won in: Speaker B:So two back to back wins.
Speaker C:So hopefully they asked them for some tips over the summer.
Speaker A:I was going to say get Ravi Shastri as a consultant for the year old said okay.
Speaker A:But a lot of this also is dependent on the, the opposition that you know, England is going to come up against and as Mike mentioned earlier, you know, Pat Cummins is out of the first test.
Speaker A:The Australian batters are also not necessarily in the greatest of form.
Speaker A:So Mike, what do you, what do you think about the Australian team as they are positioned to start the first test?
Speaker A:Obviously Steve Smith is going to take over the reins of the team but in terms of team composition, obviously they haven't selected the squads yet.
Speaker A:But based on what you have been following, what do you think about the way they're shaping up?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean I think Cummins obviously is a big mess, you know, just the quality he is.
Speaker B:But Scott Boland is a quality replacement.
Speaker B:Steve Smith is a great captain.
Speaker B:So from that first test itself I don't know if I want to read too much into that but I will say that in general the batting form was one.
Speaker B:Kwaja has not been in the best form they've been ever since, you know, Warner retired.
Speaker B:They've been struggling to find that opening partner.
Speaker B:They've gone with some, you know, really odd picks with Sam Constance and it's worked one off and things like that.
Speaker B:But most likely it sounds like Matt Renshaw is, is on the top of that list right now.
Speaker B:I'm not sure if he actually ends up opening in the Ashes at birth in the first Test but.
Speaker B:But yeah that definitely is, is been a concern I think even in general Mar, who was, you know, such a great, was in a great form for a couple of years, has had a big dip so he was in and out of the squad.
Speaker B:I, I do think like they will rely very, very heavily on of course Steve Smith but also Travis Head who has been an excel excellent form with the bat.
Speaker B:So they'll definitely have to rely on, on those two.
Speaker B:They've talked about with injuries to Cameron Green they've talked about bringing back Mitch Marsh who I mean I don't necessarily rate him really highly as a test player but he does have the tendency to come up with one offset winnings in, in Australian conditions where he does well a fantastic all rounder, you know, clearly very, very good with the bat, has a great first class record.
Speaker B:So they do have the batting.
Speaker B:I just feel their top order is not at the, you know, it's probably past their peak is probably the best way to put it.
Speaker B:And so that I think it will give England hope because if you look at just the bowling attacks and I'm assuming you know Pat Cummins gets fit and is playing second test onwards, if you just look at the bowling Attacks.
Speaker B:There's little doubt that the Australian bowling attack is, is better than the English bowling attack which is a lot more inexperienced.
Speaker B:But because there's a lot more holes in the batting on the Australian side that really makes this contest a lot more even.
Speaker B:At least that's, that's my reading of it.
Speaker C:Do you think they might open with Labashane?
Speaker B:Yeah, they've talked about that.
Speaker B:They've.
Speaker B:I mean I know Smith has tried to open as well.
Speaker B:I, I just, I don't know.
Speaker B:I feel like Matt Threnshaw has been in great form even in the.
Speaker B:I didn't watch the 220s but in the one day series against India recently he, you know, scored his debut 50 and he looked like he was, you know, just hitting the ball right beautifully right from ball one.
Speaker B:So I would back somebody who's in such great form rather than try somebody, you know, in a different position when they're already struggling.
Speaker B:At least that's my thought.
Speaker B:But obviously the selectors probably know better and they have probably had conversations with Renshaw and others.
Speaker C:My thinking is that they might, given Green is slightly injured and might not be able to bowl all that much.
Speaker C:I think they might want the insurance of having both Green and Webster in the side because then it kind of reduces the pressure on Stark, Hazelwood, Boland, which would mean then green at 3 and Webster at 6 I would have thought.
Speaker C:Which then means that Marness probably opens.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, it's, it does.
Speaker B:It did sound like they were thinking along those lines.
Speaker B:I, I think Australia have been hurt by playing four bowlers.
Speaker B:I think the Twenty20 win when India won, of course it was, you know, a crazy fourth or fifth test.
Speaker B:But more than that it was also a case of four Australian bowlers just carrying the whole series and being tired by the end of it.
Speaker B:So they definitely have been more circumspect about adding that all rounder option.
Speaker B:So I do see them thinking of playing both or maybe even bringing in Mitch Marsh if, let's say Cameron Green is still, you know, struggling with the bat.
Speaker B:So I do think it's a possibility.
Speaker B:But, but yeah, at least in my mind I would rather play the inform better, give him the best chance of succeeding.
Speaker B:But yeah, we'll see how they go about that.
Speaker C:Can certainly see having them three or four down for not very many a few times.
Speaker C:But then it's whether they can get through Steve Smith and Travis Head.
Speaker A:Right now I was saying Marnus can bowl a little bit too and get some cheap wickets with his hideous action.
Speaker A:I really Hope they persist with Sam Constance for a while.
Speaker A:And not just because, you know, he was kind of like the breakout star when he debuted.
Speaker A:I know he didn't have a great series against West Indies, and I think that's why a lot of people are like, maybe we rushed in, but given the fact that Usman Kaja probably will be playing his last Ashes here and you have Smith, you know, Marness Travis had to follow, you know, why not give him another run, like, or give him an extended run, essentially, because he's an exciting player and he.
Speaker A:At least from his domestic performances, you know, he still is scoring the runs and I think it's worth giving a shot.
Speaker A:He's an exciting batter to watch and I. I hope Australia persists with him.
Speaker C:As an England fan.
Speaker C:So do I.
Speaker A:Well, I was gonna say.
Speaker A:Well, that's a great segue because I was going to ask you, Ben, about, you know, sure, you're looking at the English team composition and all of that, but as a fan, when you're looking at, you know, Australia and their injury struggles or the form struggles of their batters, how are you feeling about England's chances?
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker B:It.
Speaker C:It's dangerous to ever say that you're confident about.
Speaker C:Yeah, particularly in Australia.
Speaker C:I. I think it makes a refreshing change that the selection debates are on the Australian side and not the English side.
Speaker C:I think we've got a good chance.
Speaker C:Like I said earlier, I can see us having them three or four down for not many a few times in the series.
Speaker C:It's just whether we can push through that middle order.
Speaker C:And of course, without Cummins, the tale's longer as well, I think.
Speaker C:You know, Boland is obviously an admirable replacement with the ball.
Speaker C:He's not as good as Cummins, but he's very good.
Speaker C:But he does lengthen that tail quite considerably.
Speaker C:You'd have Stark being a place too high at 8 and then 3 players who could arguably all bat 11.
Speaker C:So I think it's just kind of get through that middle order, get through the top order and then.
Speaker C:Well, the middle order is going to be crucial.
Speaker B:And then.
Speaker C:And then hopefully we can start mopping up the tail a bit more effectively and.
Speaker C:And bowl them out for some low scores.
Speaker A:Well, given.
Speaker A:Given Boland's bowling average, I feel like he makes up for his lack of batting talent.
Speaker A:You know, just taking wickets for next to nothing.
Speaker C:Yeah, that's true.
Speaker C:I do wonder whether I don't think England will be scared of him because they just took him apart in England.
Speaker C:I get that the Conditions are different.
Speaker C:I get that he took 6 for 7 at the MCG.
Speaker C:I, I get that his average in Australia is like 12 or something.
Speaker C:But yeah, I just don't think England will be intimidated by him in the same way that, you know, Cummins is exceptional and also exceptional with the old ball, which his record with the old ball is better than with the new ball, which is very rare.
Speaker C:So I just.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah, I think Cummins is a. Cummins is a big miss and is definitely good news for England.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think Boland is an interesting one because he's almost like Hazelwood.
Speaker B:He's like predictable in terms of what he's going to do, but he doesn't have Hazelwood space.
Speaker B:And I think that's where even when England came to India, although they didn't have a successful series, but there were many moments in that series where they were really able to push the likes of Ashwin and Jadeja.
Speaker B:And the main reason for that was because they knew what was coming.
Speaker B:Like they knew the line lines, the paces, the pace.
Speaker B:Jade Jabos, same thing with Ashwin.
Speaker B:They could understand what's going to come.
Speaker B:And that's where you saw like reverse, reverse sweeps and you know, variety of shots coming.
Speaker B:The risk taking was.
Speaker B:There's plenty of risk taking to make sure that they can undo the strengths of these bowlers.
Speaker B:And I think that's exactly what they'll do with Boland.
Speaker B:Because of that lack of extra pace, they'll be able to try something different.
Speaker B:Whether it's going down the track, whether it's making room, whatever it might be.
Speaker B:I think that is where Poland will struggle a little bit against an informed batting lineup who are not shy of taking risks which they can't do as much with bad Cummins and the variety that he has.
Speaker A:You know, I'm also curious to hear you guys thoughts on what Michael Wan said recently.
Speaker A:A couple of things stood out for me.
Speaker A:He said that first of all, England will take a two to all score line and the other was that Ben Stokes will probably become the most valuable bowler for England.
Speaker A:Ben, do you, do you agree with that and do you see any other bowler for England being critical to their chances?
Speaker C:I kind of, I kind of disagree with both of those things actually.
Speaker C:And it's not, it's not the first time.
Speaker C:I disagree with Michael Vaughan.
Speaker C:He does tend to come out with some interesting opinions.
Speaker C:But I think firstly, would we be happy with two all?
Speaker C:I mean, obviously two will be better than getting thrashed, but I don't think we'll Be happy with anything other than a win.
Speaker C:Yeah, so, so yeah, I don't agree with that.
Speaker C:And Stokes being the most important bowler, I think Stoke Stokes may be the most important player given his dual role with bat and ball and, and as, as captain.
Speaker C:But whether he's the most important bowler, I, I, I don't know.
Speaker C:I think Archer and Archer and Wood with their pace could probably be and I think Archer in particular could, could be the key man.
Speaker C:And the other one I think would be really good on kind of modern Australian pitches who, which offer quite a lot of movement is Gus Atkinson.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:So that you know, Stokes, Stokes is phenomenal.
Speaker C:I hope somebody stops him from bowling 12 over spells and breaking himself.
Speaker C:But the most important bowler, I'm not sure about that.
Speaker A:Mike, given the recent series, you know, the Anderson Tendulkar Trophy, given what you saw of England's bowling in that series, do you, do you have any thoughts on what are their best chances from a bowling perspective?
Speaker B:I mean, I agree with Ben, but the other aspect that we have to remember is Australia in recent years, especially the series against India at the end of last Australian summer was were, you know, they produced some of the most bowling friendly pitches in their history like Sydney, which is always flat, was green throughout the four days.
Speaker B:So I think if they continue doing that it really plays into the English, in English hands because we saw that in Perth when India bundled them out for I think it was like 105 or something like that.
Speaker B:They, they produced wickets which are so friendly that of course Jasper was going to take wickets.
Speaker B:I don't think anybody was surprised by that.
Speaker B:But even somebody like Harshit Rana was, you know, unplayable despite making his debut in that, in that.
Speaker B:So I think it really does matter on where Australia goes with the wickets, with the pitches.
Speaker B:I would be surprised if they have all five as really seeming friendly wickets because I think in that case you will have of course the likes of Wood and Archer who will use their pace, will hit the deck hard but then you'll bring the other skills into play with Atkinson and Stokes who move the ball.
Speaker B:So I think that would make it definitely harder especially considering the top order of Australia has been struggling a little bit.
Speaker B:So I do think the pitches will matter.
Speaker B:I expect maybe a couple of really green wickets, but maybe not all five.
Speaker B:So we'll see how that goes.
Speaker B:But that's at least my part.
Speaker B:And Perth, I would not be surprised if that is a green wicket that was certainly very, very bowler friendly when India visited and England have never actually played at The Optus stadium.
Speaker B:So that's also going to be new for them.
Speaker B:They've, I think they've only played at the back, which was a while ago, so that's a new stadium for them.
Speaker B:And yeah, so I do think that first test is going to be England's best chance.
Speaker B:As Ben said, they traveled really well.
Speaker B:And the first, first of a test, of a series at the same time, it's supposed to be bowler friendly.
Speaker B:So that would be their best chance with Pat Cummins out to really reduce the difference between the two bowling attacks and, you know, get a good first thing score and, and win the game.
Speaker B:I think other than that, if, if they end up seeing a lot of flatter wickets or wickets that, you know, become flat after a day or so, then yes, unfortunately you'll see a lot of dependence on Ben Stokes.
Speaker B:Like that is just the truth of it, because somebody like Wood or Archer, the pace that they bowl, the intensity with which they bowled, for them to last four out of five tests, they'll have to bowl in short spells.
Speaker B:So they'll leave a lot of work for Ben Stokes to do.
Speaker B:And, and, and of course Shoad Bashir comes in there.
Speaker B:We saw, I think, I don't remember how many overs bowl, but it was something like 160, 170 overs across five Tests, which is nothing, you know, which is.
Speaker B:He barely bowled against India last summer.
Speaker B:So that tells me that if wickets are that green, then Bashir is really not having a role at that point.
Speaker B:England might be better off just dropping him and going without a spinner.
Speaker C:I can see us playing, playing four seamers and, and no spinner, particularly if there's any doubt over how much Stokes can bowl.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:Yeah, I just have root balls and spin for variety and then just use.
Speaker C:Spacers and, and Bethel potentially as well.
Speaker A:Yes, and Bethel too.
Speaker C:Yeah, I totally agree with what you just said, Mike, about the pitches.
Speaker C:I think, you know, where England have struggled in the past is, is taking wickets with, with the kookaburra on, on flat decks.
Speaker C:Whereas, you know, Australia attack have been really good at that.
Speaker C:So if Australia produced green seamers throughout the series, they'll be playing into England's hands, I think.
Speaker B:And, and it's funny because I know Rob Key tried kookaburras in English county and that did not go very well either.
Speaker A:You know, on the batting front, there's been a lot of chatter about one player in particular, Joe Root.
Speaker A:Everyone seems to have an opinion on, you know, you know, on Root and his performance in Australia.
Speaker A:Given that his stature and track record overall in international cricket.
Speaker A:I don't think anybody questions he is one of the best, if not the best batter in international cricket today, or at least in Tests.
Speaker A:So what are, what do you make of his struggles in Australia?
Speaker A:Like why hasn't he been able to crack that code?
Speaker C:I think his lack of 100 in Australia is a little bit overplayed by the, It's a good media story but he averages 36 in Australia which given every tour he's been on has been a complete disaster.
Speaker C:Averaging 36 is not terrible.
Speaker C:And yeah, I just don't have any concerns about Roots ability to bat in Australian conditions.
Speaker C:I think he'll be fine and I think he will make a hundred.
Speaker C:I think Matthew Hayden made an interesting, interesting promise that if he didn't make a hundred he would run naked around the SCG or something, didn't he?
Speaker C:So I think everyone's probably hoping that.
Speaker A:A lot of pressure, everyone's hoping that.
Speaker C:Root makes the, makes the 100.
Speaker C:Early doors.
Speaker A:Mike, what are, what are your thoughts on that?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean I do think like the form that he's in, I think he's taken his game to another level.
Speaker B:I mean he was already, already elite batter but last couple of years he's taken it to another level in terms of, you know, also scoring at a much, much more brisk rate, taking more chances and still having the output that he's always had.
Speaker B:So yeah, I do think like it's high, it's about time that he's going to have that successful, like really successful Australian tour.
Speaker B:It's, there's a lot of others who are, you know, players like Jacob Bethel who are touring for the first time.
Speaker B:So it'll be important for Johoru to, you know, play that anchor who, around which the England team can step up and, and perform.
Speaker B:Yeah, I do think I like the English batting way more than I like the Australian batting right now.
Speaker B:But that's of course, you know, it's a long series, things can change.
Speaker B:We saw even in the last Ashes in England that Australia started really well.
Speaker B:They were tunnel up and then almost lost 32 if not for the weather interrupting.
Speaker B:So I do think these things change quite a bit in series as long as these.
Speaker B:But yeah, I do hope that Joe Root starts well because if they, if he does and to my point earlier, you know, they, they travel well in the first game.
Speaker B:If they win that one early, I think we're gonna have an amazing series rather than one of those one sided ones where, you know, things just don't fall into place and then Australia walk all over them.
Speaker A:You know, we can't do an entire episode on the Ashes and not mention basball.
Speaker A:You know, it's, it's been years since this term has been coined and I feel like every series at India, every series at England plays.
Speaker A:You know, it's almost like we have to talk about it, but I'm just curious.
Speaker A:There doesn't seem to be that much chatter about it anymore.
Speaker A:Do you think we've kind of pass that phase of, you know, basketball this, basketball that and just accepted that England just play, you know, this.
Speaker A:They follow Brandon McCollum's philosophy of just bad hard and fast and not make it like it's just the most unique thing in the world.
Speaker C:I think everyone's used to it by now, aren't they?
Speaker C:It's probably worth noting that the England team don't use the phrase basball and they, as you, McCollum doesn't like it, but yeah, I think everyone's just used to the, to that style of cricket now.
Speaker C:I think there's also kind of, there's been some fundamental misunderstandings about, about what it is and people think it's just kind of trying to score a very quick run rate, but I think it's, it goes, it goes a lot deeper than that and a lot of it's, a lot of it's on the bowling side.
Speaker C:It's, it's trying to, trying to take wickets at all costs and, and being prepared to go at higher economy rates is setting attack is.
Speaker C:It's about taking the positive option where possible and transferring pressure back onto the opposition where possible.
Speaker C:And I think that's, you know, and that's just the, that's just the way they play and it's kind of ingrained and they've, they've, they've picked players that they know can, can play that way and yeah, hope hopefully they, they actually get some results with it because there have been some near misses with obviously 2, 2 in, in England last time and 2, 2, 2 against India last time.
Speaker C:And so yeah, it's about time we, we won a series against top tier opposition using these methods.
Speaker C:Otherwise I think it might be consigned to the history books.
Speaker C:And yeah, something else.
Speaker C:I do think they've also toned it down like you saw against India in the summer.
Speaker C:Definitely played they adapted in a slightly more circumspect way where the, when the conditions and the match situation dictated that, that they needed to dig in, they, they did so in a way that haven't seen them do before.
Speaker C:And so I think maybe this is kind of, you know, Basball 2.0 and they've kind of adapted it and hopefully, hopefully it comes off this winter.
Speaker A:Let's end this episode by, you know, just.
Speaker A:We'll actually talk about our predictions for this as well.
Speaker A:But, you know, Ash's banter are just part of, part of the whole deal.
Speaker A:You know, from X players to current players to commentators, everyone has very strong opinions.
Speaker A:It's, it's never measured or very diplomatic when it comes to Ashes.
Speaker A: weakest Australian team since: Speaker A:Warner and McGrath have predicted an easy win for Australia, which they always do against any opposition.
Speaker A:Anyway, I'm just curious to hear what's your take on all of the, the banter and, you know, yeah, just what do you think about the banter game so far?
Speaker A:Has it been weak?
Speaker A:Has it been like, you know, the.
Speaker C:Usual standard is the same every time.
Speaker C:It's the usual suspects predicting five NILs, etc.
Speaker C:And, you know, it's all good fun, but it does start to start to grate on me a bit, especially when it starts so far out.
Speaker C:Especially David Warner, who's an abrasive character.
Speaker C:Perhaps abrasive is the wrong choice of word there, given the history, but.
Speaker A:He'S.
Speaker C:One of the people who keeps coming out with this moral victory line.
Speaker C:And that just really annoys me because it's just like it was a throwaway comment in response to a journalist saying to Harry Brooke, if they, if they win at the Oval after rain, had, you know, denied them, or Trafford, if they win the Oval, could that be considered a moral victory?
Speaker C:And Brooks said, yes, perhaps it could.
Speaker C:And now every single social media post, every interview, whatever it is, is just kind of littered with Australians using the phrase moral victory.
Speaker C:And that's just right, right.
Speaker A:Mike?
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, I, I agree with Ben.
Speaker B:It does get.
Speaker B:It's, it's fun when it's like three months away from the Ashes.
Speaker B:I do enjoy, like randomly seeing, you know, Broad making random statement statements like that and laugh about it.
Speaker B:But as the series gets closer, obviously everybody knows it's time for business and all of this gets in the past.
Speaker B:So, yeah, it's always fun.
Speaker B:But I do always find it really funny with Glenn McGrath in particular, because I have never seen him predict anything other than 5 0, no matter the opposition.
Speaker B:So it's, it's really funny.
Speaker B:I just, I just think he, he belonged to a team with Shane Warren where they just did not Lose.
Speaker B:And so that's all he can think about, which is, which is really funny because I would think when you're not in the middle of it, you would learn to be a little more objective, but apparently that's not a strength.
Speaker A:You know, speaking of which, Stuart Broad and David Warner are, you know, no longer playing for their respective teams.
Speaker A:And I think that's just sad because, you know, for all their cricketing skills, I, I think what the extra factor that they brought was just their ability to annoy the opposition, the opposition fans.
Speaker A:And so I wonder who's going to take their place, you know, like, is it going to be Harry Brooks himself for England and for Australia?
Speaker A:You know, like, I don't know.
Speaker A:I don't even know if there's a good replacement for David Warner.
Speaker A:And the annoyable, you know, annoyability factor.
Speaker B:Does a good job maybe.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Martin's just more behavioral.
Speaker A:I think it's behavior is what Eric's, you know, his, his quirks and his mannerisms is what.
Speaker A:But in terms of just saying stuff that just like, riles up, you know, the opposition players and fans, you know, we need, we need new replacements, but we'll see.
Speaker A:We'll see.
Speaker A:You know, every Ashes brings some new story, new characters to the forefront, so I'm sure there's.
Speaker A:This Ashes is not going to be any different in that regard.
Speaker A:But, you know, just as we predicted for the Women's World cup, what are you guys prediction for the final score line?
Speaker C:I think it's going to be closer than, than people expect.
Speaker C:It's obviously really tough to win in Australia, but England have got their best team over there and, you know, the best team they've had in a while and, and their style of play means they won't be intimidated, which I think that's half the battle going to Australia.
Speaker C:And conversely, you know, Australia have got their worst batting lineup in years and Kawaja and Consuls aren't exactly Hayden and Langer.
Speaker C:A lot depends on how many tests Cummins can play, I think, and any, any injuries to any of the other quicks and they're starting to scrape the barrel a bit, I think.
Speaker C:So I'm.
Speaker C:I'm going to go with 3, 2, but I'm not sure which way.
Speaker C:But as you said earlier, I hope England win the first.
Speaker C:If England win the first Test, that'll set the series up perfectly and it will be a cracker.
Speaker C:I think if Australia win the first Test, then there's a danger that it slips away quite quickly.
Speaker C:But yeah, overall can't wait.
Speaker C:I'll be nocturnal for most of the winter and hopefully won't be sitting on my sofa with my head in my hands crying like normal.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:I'm gonna go with 3:1 to Australia.
Speaker B:But as I said, I think if the pitches are bowler friendly, I think it'll be 2:2.
Speaker B:Could be 3:2 to England.
Speaker B:But yeah, I do think it's going to be 3:1 to Australia.
Speaker B:I think they still have just enough.
Speaker B:Assuming injuries and all of that fall in place or fitness falls in place rather.
Speaker A:I, I, I could see a two all score line.
Speaker A:I just don't think England are good enough to fight force and outright series win.
Speaker A:And Australia, even with a slight edge, I think they're going to come up against, you know, an inspirational Stokes performance or someone else just, you know, delivering a once in a lifetime performance.
Speaker A:So I think this is gonna end up in a drawn series which I just feel like would automatically lend itself to a classic, a classic contest.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:All right, gentlemen, well, thank you so much for your time and I think we still have plenty more time down the road to talk about the Ashes and even as it's going on and after it ends.
Speaker A:But till then, once again, Ben, thank you so much for joining us today.
Speaker C:Pleasure as always.
Speaker C:Nice to see you both.
Speaker A:Yes, and Mayank, same to you as well.
Speaker A:Thanks for joining in on the call to our listeners.
Speaker A:Thank you for listening and we'll talk to you next time.
